One pollster sees “flashing red” signs on youth turnout as Gen Z and millennial voters, who are not satisfied with either party, could again play a decisive role in the next election.
I kind of feel like a lot of folks here might be focusing on the wrong thing. If you’re upset with the DNC leadership, etc, then it’s not even a question of turnout for the presidential election. The only way to change the party is voting at a local level. That’s the long-term view. Vote on the people you want to see as leaders locally, and support them as they move up the chain.
Is this easy/fast? Hell no. A major frustration I have at all levels — local, state, and federal — is how Democrats seem to refuse to build a bench and stick to incumbents because of a multitude of reasons people have already expressed here. But that’s the only way to start, and it’s a hell of a better reason than “stop the GOP.”
The Republicans have made it a point that there will be NO ticket where a democrat runs unopposed. They knew local laws would help. Hell, right now you can’t get a head of a library fight going without the republicans turning it into an outright vicious fight. They want to control all levels of government and are willing to do it. I was pissed during the election on Hillary on “Well, she’s not good enough” while not paying attention that they were aiming at the Supreme Court.
When it’s said “Go out and vote” it isn’t meant every 4 years when the presidential fight is up. It’s that daily grind over stupid petty laws that they chip away on in the cities, counties, etc that you need to be able to show up. The Republicans, and if you consider them separate the far right absolutely get this. I am shocked by the lefts inability to comprehend it.
“Just vote local” I’m from the Rio Grande Valley and saw firsthand that the national party will openly support an anti-choice pro-gun candidate if the alternative is a progressive. They would rather women lose rights and children be murdered in school than the nightmare scenario of a candidate who might one day consider voting to raise the minimum wage. When the party quits pulling shit like that, I’ll quit pointing it out.
Same in Pittsburgh. The DNC backed the incumbent who was so conservative he ran on the Republican ticket when he was successfully primaried off the Democratic ticket by a progressive. The progressive won the general election too, but the DNC sure want happy about it.
The DNC doesn’t have any involvement in local candidates, they’re only concerned about the presidency. You probably mean the DCCC if you’re talking about a house rep. DNC is not short for the Democratic party, it’s a specific committee.
I have every right to be mad as hell when my party opposes progressives harder than it opposes republicans. I already vote for democrats. I’m a good little hostage to the lesser evil. You don’t have to gloat that I’ll never have a real choice in the matter.
EDIT: I needed to bold that because centrists kept missing it their rush to be condescending.
Where is anyone saying you don’t have the right to be mad when the Major Party that represents you squashes Progressives. I sure don’t see that anywhere in this thread.
All I see is that people are telling you that you have every right to fight for Progressive candidates, but when push comes to shove and the choice is between the Red tyrant, and the Blue spineless creature, don’t be distracted by the Green and Yellow ‘protest’ votes because you didn’t get the progressive you wanted. The cost of doing that may well see our Republic replaced by a Republican Dictatorship.
Imma about to drop some history on you. The United States has only seen three instances of a Minor Party becoming a Major Party in its history, and all three changes corresponded with the first three ‘Party Systems’ in the United States. The Zeroth Party System (my own term) was that idealistic time when Washington publicly advocated for no parties, while aligning himself with what would arise as the First Party System in 1789. This put Jefferson’s Democratic-Republicans against the Adams’ and Hamilton-led Federalists. Both parties had a bit of a breakdown in the early 1820s, with Jefferson’s Democratic-Republicans breaking off into a more Jacksonian Democratic Party as Jeffersonian principles got left behind, and the Federalists outright replaced by the Whigs, as the Second Party System got started. Then, as Slavery became a big issue, the Whigs got left behind by events as the Republicans emerged to oppose the Democrats in the Third Party System.
The Whigs being replaced by the Republicans was the last time a Minor Party rose to prominence in US politics, despite there being between 3 and 4 more party systems. The Fourth Party System saw the Republicans grow out of their anti-Slavery roots as they became the party of Industrialisation, while the Democrats continued their historical role as Voice of the South and everything that represented. The Democrats started evolving away from their role of being the party of Southern Landowners to more speaking for the common man as Northern Democrats embraced FDR’s New Deal. And the Sixth System saw the Republicans embrace the dissatisfied Southern (Conservative) Democrats when the Democrats embraced minorities after the 1960s. Not once after 1856 has any party come anywhere close to upsetting the Democrats and Republicans, with MAYBE the closest being Ross Perot in the 1990s.
There’s a new realignment going on now. Civil Rights has been absorbed into a much larger question. The Republicans and their core Southern Dixiecrat constituency has decided that the work of winning elections should be dispensed with, and they given dictatorial powers in the United States. Let me make this clear to you, Ensign. You grumble about how mean the Dems are to Progressives. We just want to remind you that Republican voters are gleefully sharing pictures of a stolen cartoon character wearing Trump’s hair and a Nazi SS officer’s uniform, forcing people ranging from Hillary and Obama, through people like you, down to Minorities and Jews and Gays, into very clear cartoon reproductions of gas chambers and ovens. We’re saying that the OTHER side will be following the rules of “Vote for our guy in the closest Major Party primary, and the Major Party candidate closest to our ideology in the General.” Either we do that as well, or we go down like the Left did in Iran in 1980 when the Ayatollah in Iran outlawed the very same Anarchists, Intellectuals, Artists, and Leftists that worked with him to overthrow the Shah.
Let me make this clear to you, Ensign. You grumble about how mean the Dems are to Progressives. We just want to remind you that Republican voters are gleefully sharing pictures of a stolen cartoon character wearing Trump’s hair and a Nazi SS officer’s uniform, forcing people ranging from Hillary and Obama, through people like you, down to Minorities and Jews and Gays, into very clear cartoon reproductions of gas chambers and ovens.
I don’t need reminding. It’s already clear. It’s why I already vote for Democrats. It’s why I said I vote for Democrats in the comment you’re replying to. Thanks for the condescension and the history I already know.
All I see is that people are telling you that you have every right to fight for Progressive candidates, but when push comes to shove and the choice is between the Red tyrant, and the Blue spineless creature, don’t be distracted by the Green and Yellow ‘protest’ votes because you didn’t get the progressive you wanted. The cost of doing that may well see our Republic replaced by a Republican Dictatorship.
The question isn’t whether or not we are going to be turned into a dictatorship, it’s how soon. The “spineless blue creatures” you mention are allowing things to slowly move in that direction. If nothing major changes, we will be there eventually. The blue creatures need to wake the hell up, stop taking the corporate money, and save the country if that is truly their objective.
Honestly? Grow up. This crap is too important not to.
You didn’t get what you wanted. Neither did I (I was ready to vote for fricking Yang if it meant moving a few notches toward UBI).
You know who else didn’t get what they wanted? Roughly half the population of the united states who lost a basic human right because people couldn’t get off their asses and vote for Hilary.
So rather than sit there and say “woe is me” and act like you are the greatest victim: Maybe consider who the actual victims are when people throw hissies?
Honestly? Grow up. This crap is too important not to.
Honestly? I vote like you want already. You don’t get to order me to be happy about it.
You know who else didn’t get what they wanted? Roughly half the population of the united states who lost a basic human right because people couldn’t get off their asses and vote for Hilary.
I voted for Clinton in 2016. I’ve been blamed for her loss ever since by people like you because evidently I should have faked an orgasm when I did.
I’ve seen more hostility directed at progressives on this thread alone than I’ve seen directed at fascists on all of this instance. It’s greatly discouraging, because I thought I left reddit.
What a shame that an 81 year old man (who used to be the “nobody cares about cspan” meme) is the last hope of all of humanity
Bernie failed. Why doesn’t matter. What matters is that you dust yourself off, and continue fighting the good fight. POTUS matters for the supreme court, but not for “change”. For that, you need local politicians and state representatives. Because then? The party will “put their thumb on the scale” in your favor because the party is you. The Squad might be a bit stupid at times, but they are 100% what we need to be pushing for.
The DNC of today is a LOT farther left than the DNC of even Bill Clinton. It is far from perfect and needs a LOT of work, but even Joe “I wish I was a cop” Biden has been pushing some really good stuff as his big efforts (and dicking over unions but… Liberals).
Yeah, even fighting locally can be really frustrating, and I live in a supposedly extremely progressive area. It can be even more frustrating when people will be all, “I’m not conservative, I voted for Obama/Clinton/Biden!” as if that means anything. Still, it heartens me to find like-minded people out there fighting the endless fight, because they are out there.
I don’t blame people for moving to a different party, since they almost always vote for the Democrat anyway if there’s even a chance that that seat is in danger. I personally believe in making change from inside the party, but to be entirely honest I’m pretty burnt out and am taking an indefinite break. :\
Problem with local level stuff is that being a politician is a full time job for part-time pay. So who could possibly take off all that time from work and take the financial hit? Two groups: Retired people and Rich people. The two groups that are out of touch with the common working person.
Retired oldsters are the worst. My Father in law has been planning this big thing for his 50th wedding anniversary and only on monday did he come to the realization that having it on a thursday (today) instead of saturday would mean people needed to take a day off to attend a 9 am breakfast followed by more.
Oh and he asked if I’d had a chance to check the tie rods on his motorhome yet, he asked last night after dark, and seemed upset that I hadn’t instantly put his whims to the top of my list of shit to do.
I’m picking on him here but all that retired generation are like this in my experience. To call them out of touch with with the common working person is a MASSIVE understatement.
I kind of feel like a lot of folks here might be focusing on the wrong thing. If you’re upset with the DNC leadership, etc, then it’s not even a question of turnout for the presidential election. The only way to change the party is voting at a local level. That’s the long-term view. Vote on the people you want to see as leaders locally, and support them as they move up the chain.
Is this easy/fast? Hell no. A major frustration I have at all levels — local, state, and federal — is how Democrats seem to refuse to build a bench and stick to incumbents because of a multitude of reasons people have already expressed here. But that’s the only way to start, and it’s a hell of a better reason than “stop the GOP.”
100% this.
The Republicans have made it a point that there will be NO ticket where a democrat runs unopposed. They knew local laws would help. Hell, right now you can’t get a head of a library fight going without the republicans turning it into an outright vicious fight. They want to control all levels of government and are willing to do it. I was pissed during the election on Hillary on “Well, she’s not good enough” while not paying attention that they were aiming at the Supreme Court.
When it’s said “Go out and vote” it isn’t meant every 4 years when the presidential fight is up. It’s that daily grind over stupid petty laws that they chip away on in the cities, counties, etc that you need to be able to show up. The Republicans, and if you consider them separate the far right absolutely get this. I am shocked by the lefts inability to comprehend it.
“Just vote local” I’m from the Rio Grande Valley and saw firsthand that the national party will openly support an anti-choice pro-gun candidate if the alternative is a progressive. They would rather women lose rights and children be murdered in school than the nightmare scenario of a candidate who might one day consider voting to raise the minimum wage. When the party quits pulling shit like that, I’ll quit pointing it out.
Same in Pittsburgh. The DNC backed the incumbent who was so conservative he ran on the Republican ticket when he was successfully primaried off the Democratic ticket by a progressive. The progressive won the general election too, but the DNC sure want happy about it.
The DNC doesn’t have any involvement in local candidates, they’re only concerned about the presidency. You probably mean the DCCC if you’re talking about a house rep. DNC is not short for the Democratic party, it’s a specific committee.
Point it out. Fight to support candidates who represent you. That is literally what primary season is for.
But when it is time to vote against republicans:? It is time to pick the lesser of two evils. Or else we lose even more basic human rights.
I have every right to be mad as hell when my party opposes progressives harder than it opposes republicans. I already vote for democrats. I’m a good little hostage to the lesser evil. You don’t have to gloat that I’ll never have a real choice in the matter.
EDIT: I needed to bold that because centrists kept missing it their rush to be condescending.
Where is anyone saying you don’t have the right to be mad when the Major Party that represents you squashes Progressives. I sure don’t see that anywhere in this thread.
All I see is that people are telling you that you have every right to fight for Progressive candidates, but when push comes to shove and the choice is between the Red tyrant, and the Blue spineless creature, don’t be distracted by the Green and Yellow ‘protest’ votes because you didn’t get the progressive you wanted. The cost of doing that may well see our Republic replaced by a Republican Dictatorship.
Imma about to drop some history on you. The United States has only seen three instances of a Minor Party becoming a Major Party in its history, and all three changes corresponded with the first three ‘Party Systems’ in the United States. The Zeroth Party System (my own term) was that idealistic time when Washington publicly advocated for no parties, while aligning himself with what would arise as the First Party System in 1789. This put Jefferson’s Democratic-Republicans against the Adams’ and Hamilton-led Federalists. Both parties had a bit of a breakdown in the early 1820s, with Jefferson’s Democratic-Republicans breaking off into a more Jacksonian Democratic Party as Jeffersonian principles got left behind, and the Federalists outright replaced by the Whigs, as the Second Party System got started. Then, as Slavery became a big issue, the Whigs got left behind by events as the Republicans emerged to oppose the Democrats in the Third Party System.
The Whigs being replaced by the Republicans was the last time a Minor Party rose to prominence in US politics, despite there being between 3 and 4 more party systems. The Fourth Party System saw the Republicans grow out of their anti-Slavery roots as they became the party of Industrialisation, while the Democrats continued their historical role as Voice of the South and everything that represented. The Democrats started evolving away from their role of being the party of Southern Landowners to more speaking for the common man as Northern Democrats embraced FDR’s New Deal. And the Sixth System saw the Republicans embrace the dissatisfied Southern (Conservative) Democrats when the Democrats embraced minorities after the 1960s. Not once after 1856 has any party come anywhere close to upsetting the Democrats and Republicans, with MAYBE the closest being Ross Perot in the 1990s.
There’s a new realignment going on now. Civil Rights has been absorbed into a much larger question. The Republicans and their core Southern Dixiecrat constituency has decided that the work of winning elections should be dispensed with, and they given dictatorial powers in the United States. Let me make this clear to you, Ensign. You grumble about how mean the Dems are to Progressives. We just want to remind you that Republican voters are gleefully sharing pictures of a stolen cartoon character wearing Trump’s hair and a Nazi SS officer’s uniform, forcing people ranging from Hillary and Obama, through people like you, down to Minorities and Jews and Gays, into very clear cartoon reproductions of gas chambers and ovens. We’re saying that the OTHER side will be following the rules of “Vote for our guy in the closest Major Party primary, and the Major Party candidate closest to our ideology in the General.” Either we do that as well, or we go down like the Left did in Iran in 1980 when the Ayatollah in Iran outlawed the very same Anarchists, Intellectuals, Artists, and Leftists that worked with him to overthrow the Shah.
I don’t need reminding. It’s already clear. It’s why I already vote for Democrats. It’s why I said I vote for Democrats in the comment you’re replying to. Thanks for the condescension and the history I already know.
The question isn’t whether or not we are going to be turned into a dictatorship, it’s how soon. The “spineless blue creatures” you mention are allowing things to slowly move in that direction. If nothing major changes, we will be there eventually. The blue creatures need to wake the hell up, stop taking the corporate money, and save the country if that is truly their objective.
Honestly? Grow up. This crap is too important not to.
You didn’t get what you wanted. Neither did I (I was ready to vote for fricking Yang if it meant moving a few notches toward UBI).
You know who else didn’t get what they wanted? Roughly half the population of the united states who lost a basic human right because people couldn’t get off their asses and vote for Hilary.
So rather than sit there and say “woe is me” and act like you are the greatest victim: Maybe consider who the actual victims are when people throw hissies?
Honestly? I vote like you want already. You don’t get to order me to be happy about it.
I voted for Clinton in 2016. I’ve been blamed for her loss ever since by people like you because evidently I should have faked an orgasm when I did.
You will never make the corpocrat supporters happy until you kneel and pledge lifetime fealty to the DNC. Best to stop trying to appease them.
I’ve seen more hostility directed at progressives on this thread alone than I’ve seen directed at fascists on all of this instance. It’s greatly discouraging, because I thought I left reddit.
I thought I had as well.
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That was tried with Bernie. And they put their thumb on the scale.
What a shame that an 81 year old man (who used to be the “nobody cares about cspan” meme) is the last hope of all of humanity
Bernie failed. Why doesn’t matter. What matters is that you dust yourself off, and continue fighting the good fight. POTUS matters for the supreme court, but not for “change”. For that, you need local politicians and state representatives. Because then? The party will “put their thumb on the scale” in your favor because the party is you. The Squad might be a bit stupid at times, but they are 100% what we need to be pushing for.
The DNC of today is a LOT farther left than the DNC of even Bill Clinton. It is far from perfect and needs a LOT of work, but even Joe “I wish I was a cop” Biden has been pushing some really good stuff as his big efforts (and dicking over unions but… Liberals).
I’m kind of at the opposite end of the experience. We usually have one guy in each of the blue column items, totally unopposed locally.
That district is somewhat rural in West Texas right?
Yeah, even fighting locally can be really frustrating, and I live in a supposedly extremely progressive area. It can be even more frustrating when people will be all, “I’m not conservative, I voted for Obama/Clinton/Biden!” as if that means anything. Still, it heartens me to find like-minded people out there fighting the endless fight, because they are out there.
I don’t blame people for moving to a different party, since they almost always vote for the Democrat anyway if there’s even a chance that that seat is in danger. I personally believe in making change from inside the party, but to be entirely honest I’m pretty burnt out and am taking an indefinite break. :\
Problem with local level stuff is that being a politician is a full time job for part-time pay. So who could possibly take off all that time from work and take the financial hit? Two groups: Retired people and Rich people. The two groups that are out of touch with the common working person.
Retired oldsters are the worst. My Father in law has been planning this big thing for his 50th wedding anniversary and only on monday did he come to the realization that having it on a thursday (today) instead of saturday would mean people needed to take a day off to attend a 9 am breakfast followed by more.
Oh and he asked if I’d had a chance to check the tie rods on his motorhome yet, he asked last night after dark, and seemed upset that I hadn’t instantly put his whims to the top of my list of shit to do.
I’m picking on him here but all that retired generation are like this in my experience. To call them out of touch with with the common working person is a MASSIVE understatement.