I guess it is a consequence of the Reddit migration where the habit is just keeping the old community name. But having C/Politics being US only on Lemmy.world, an instance that aims to be international (hence the name), seems weird to me.
Would have been cool to give up this assumption that everything is related to US by default when moving away from Reddit. I mean, even the canadian political news of Lemmy.ca is CanadaPolitics.
More than weird, it should be corrected.
How quickly we want to become Reddit I guess.
Well, that community is just as toxic and block-worthy as the reddit sub already. Mission accomplished.
I was more meaning wanting the admins to fuck around with the communities a la /u/spez.
You can always leave to another instance or make your own if you don’t like the admins. Proper democracy in action. Wasn’t like that on Reddit.
Only fair if you use a generic name like “politics” and make it only about US.
So should all instance users get to vote on what every community is for? Do the creators and mods of that community not get to decide that?
I actually took the other side of this argument when Lemmy was ramping up, that the concept of Federation needed to change to make the system more accessible to non-technical users. And I was told that my idea (federating the communities) was counter to the freedom that Lemmy was designed around.
It can’t be both ways. It’s a cathedral, or it’s a bazaar. But if it’s a bazaar then we have to deal with the reality that sometimes people beat us to the places we want and have different ideas for what they should be.
Nothing is stopping you from starting worldpolitics, globalpolitics, politics2 or politics on another instance.
If it was on an instance named america.yeehaw that was clearly US centric it could make sense in that context.
in that context.
Or Android and then lock it.
True, Lemmy users act like a bunch of landed gentries and Admins really shouldn’t allow this! /s
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That seems to be the nature of people who want to discuss politics online.
As long as they can’t remove a comment without even a reason or a notification, it will hardly be as toxic, although it can still be plenty toxic.
It’s the actions that Reddit took that were the problem, not admins taking action in general. But as long as there are alternatives from federation I don’t see an issue with admins doing something about this, whether or not I agree with it.
Are the admins deleting global content or something? If not, wouldn’t correcting it just be more people from other countries posting their own political news?
It’s part of the rules:
Must be articles relevant to US political news. Links must be to quality and original content. Articles should be worth reading. Clickbait, stub articles, and rehosted or stolen content are not allowed.
It should change its name to US Leftist Politics. The mod u/YoBuckStopsHere is responsible for 80 percent of the posts and its comes with their bias. Their mods also delete posts and dont enforce the TOS. If you want to have any educated discussion about politics, thats not the place. Its a very close minded, hostile crowd over there.
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Lemmy.world is full of US-specific things. It’s quite bizarre that US is probably the only major country that doesn’t have its own instance. I’ve already noted it. And predicted it a month ago, but that didn’t go anywhere.
What do you mean. the USA ain’t the whole world?
Segue: Is there a way to enlarge these images on jerboa? They are teeny, and all touching them in any way does is hide/close the comment.
Edit: I see on Connect they actually work as links and can be opened in a new tab.
Not for now. I’m waiting for that feature to be implemented.
Every country in the world belongs to America
You can tell this isn’t true because not every country is a fucked up mess
Yes they are, they’re just fucked in different ways.
Not a fucked up mess…. Yet!
But we’re working on it! Here at the CIA our goal is to give you the freedom every red blooded American enjoys! Like the freedom to never go to the doctor because of the cost! Being shot at school because religious nut jobs think Jesus wants it that way! Work your self to death to stay just below the poverty line! Watch as the social safety net your forefathers literally died for gets eroded away as you too embrace Christo-facism!
We can’t WAIT to bring this opportunity to your shores! Work with us in serving the billionaire working class and enjoy all the benefits above!
World like world, or world like World Series?
You could just sign up for Kbin. It already lets you block instances from it’s front end. I can’t speak to the diversity of something like kbin.social in regards to US vs elsewhere though. Personally, I think a language filter would be nice. For example instances (or even community/magazine level) could have a default language property and you’d be allowed to filter on that. It’d be a shame to block an entire instance just because it’s in a different country.
In regards to “US-specific” instances, I think the issue is more that folks in the US see less incentive to shoulder those costs if they can’t sell it. The charitable bodies willing to do this or that I’d even trust to do it are few and far between. All of this is just a theory though. I have nothing but my gut feeling to back it up. So take it with a grain of salt.
Personally, I think a language filter would be nice. For example instances (or even community/magazine level) could have a default language property and you’d be allowed to filter on that.
Wouldn’t help with the US-defaultism-problem though. English is
a) spoken in Europe as well (I mean… that’s where it’s from)
b) lingua franca for all the worldThe fact that most of the world can’t really filter English discussions but English native speakers can filter almost everyone else’s just by language alone is part of the problem. Besides, you can already filter which languages you want to see in your profile settings.
I don’t have a problem with default-US on principle. I don’t want to filter out anything other than what I can’t read.
And don’t make assumptions. I can’t filter based on language. I really think most people are just failing this whole fediverse concept. I’m not even on lemmy.world let alone even using Lemmy.
I can’t filter based on language as far as I can tell on Kbin. I can already block communities/magazines, users, and entire domains for that matter. Kbin already “solved” this problem. My issue here is that it’s not a problem. If an instance is general purpose and a community doesn’t break any of its rules, I see no reason to be upset that someone took a community name before someone else. I’m not about to get behind the censorship bandwagon of majority rules (or maybe not even majority, just loud) taking over communities because they feel they can use the name in a better way.
Blocking an instance doesn’t help if everything is piled on Lemmy.world… Unless I’d want to block this.
I mean… As it is, lemmy.world is shouldering all the cost, so it can’t be impossible.
I’d prefer a language translator that translates everything to your default language, that way we can all communicate.
Isn’t beehaw in the US? Also midwest.social? Or do you mean an instance run by the country itself?
Beehaw is a locked down walled garden instance that doesn’t seem to actually want to be everyone’s go to. That’s fine, but it doesn’t mean it makes sense for most people to join it.
Midwest.social is only specific to a small region of the US.
I don’t think every country necessarily needs their own instance though.
Beehaw is a locked down walled garden instance
That’s maybe a little unkind. If you had been working to nurture a small community (vernacular definition), you too would be super concerned about a sudden influx from Reddit. Assimilation would be impossible.
Huh, that is kind of surprising that there isn’t one for the United States or North America
Midwest.social is only specific to a small region of the US
Um. Have you ever been to the midwest? If you’re in Kansas and your dog runs away you’ll still see it for 3 days
I mean like feddit.de, feddit.it, feddit.ch, feddit.uk, aussie.zone, lemmy.nz, feddit.cl, lemmy.eco.br, szmer.info… So if you want to have a community about a city in the country, or politics, or a sports team/league, that’s a better place to place for it than !texas@lemmy.world or !oregon@lemmy.world.
It also makes it easier for geographic features with the same name in multiple countries.
I disagree with the concept that there’s a better place for anything. If my account is here, I will create a community/magazine here. I’m not going to segregate myself simply because of my location. You can argue that an instance should suggest naming conventions for localized topics. But it’s up to the instance to require that. There’s no real rules between instances at all. So I find the discussion that a community doesn’t belong in a general purpose instance. If it doesn’t conflict with the intent of the instance and the instance has no naming convention, it’s first come, first serve.
Creating generic rules to apply to other instances aside from the protocol is simply not what the fediverse is about.
Edit to add: also, there’s no default instance for a country either. Sure those that you mentioned exist, but there’s no rule saying Germans need to put German specific things in feddit.de.
There’s gonna be a lot of culture shock from authoritarians throughout the fediverse it would seem. Some people don’t know what to do with a little freedom.
People are generally good with having their own freedom, where they get outraged is when they discover that other people have freedom. Obviously this situation can’t be allowed so rules need to be made, and enforced, so those other people have to conform.
I don’t know why some people are treating my complains like I’m some sort of Judge Dredd that wants to shoot everybody who makes a community I don’t like.
I’m saying, be reasonable. I wouldn’t be making a community on .world about some random 4th league football club or a hike trail in my country, I’d use an instance more suited for it. If you can’t make a new community there, ping an admin to make it for you. It’s not a big deal, and better for everybody: locals can find it more easily, and the others won’t be bothered by it by default.
The reverse is also stupid, creating general-purpose comms on country-specific instances. Once instance blocking becomes an option, nobody will find them.
For real, how is it that every bloody country can make its own instance, but only the US can’t? Doesn’t it strike you just a bit weird? I’m no more interested what’s going on in Oregon than in Frankfurt.
As far as I know, you can only create communities on your own instance. I don’t like the idea of telling people that need to create accounts elsewhere becsuse their community isn’t welcome.
A general purpose instance is general purpose. As long as it doesn’t break any rules, it should be welcomed.
And segregating the fediverse is literally not what it’s about. There shouldn’t be forced segregation.
Instances shouldn’t be localized unless that’s its purpose. If there was a feddit.us that was general purpose, I’d be fine if someone from the UK created a football community first.
There’s no such thing as a better place for something in the fediverse. There’s only not acceptable places. And general purpose has a very low bar for acceptable.
I feel like most folks don’t get the idea behind the fediverse and the multi-instance concept.
You just fail to see anyone else’s point besides yours. I already addressed your objections, and you’re unable to address mine, so I won’t be repeating myself.
Your argument is “be reasonable” and then some subjective feeling about what you feel is personally reasonable. Your reason isn’t objective. I addressed this in literally every comment in some fashion. Your feelings aren’t an argument.
Edit: especially since you never addressed the technical limitations I mentioned in any way shape or fashion. That’s a much bigger hurdle than your opinions about what fits in general purpose.
Midwest.social is pretty close, but yeah, I’m surprised there isn’t just an America/North America lemmy.
Interesting point. I’ve seen that some country instances have a !europe community. And I wouldn’t be against a full instance either. It could be useful.
I am sure the fact they don’t use they ccTLD “.us” (not even the government) is part of that mentality. The internet is kind of built to be usanian by default
As someone living in the United States, I personally do not want to be on a US only instance. US is a burning pile of poop right now. Please save us
You can stay if you learn other worldly dialects. Repeat after me: Cunt. Bloody Yanks. Fa- (ok maybe not that one). Guten Tag.
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Because according to Americans, they are The Normal.
It definitely should change its name to US Politics.
Is it US politics simply because there are far, far more Americans on there than from any other country (especially English-speaking)… or is it US politics because other threads are blocked and/or deleted?
There’s a rather large distinction there.
We love you Canada, but let’s be real here, there are almost 10x more Americans than there are Canadians, so naturally there are going to be more political stories posted about the country with the much larger population. If non-US posts are deleted, on the other hand, then that’s messed up.
The latter. Rule 2 of the community is “Must be articles relevant to US political news.”
Interesting. OK, so that clears things up.
Yep, nice and easy decision to block that community then lol
It’s most likely because r/politics on Reddit was that way, and people tend to make subreddit clones on Lemmy.
Right, which I think is the root problem. Not all the subreddit names were great - I would have liked to have seen us try to do better - but I think many were just trying to make the correlation between communities and subreddits as obvious as possible.
I see it as kind of a first generation migrant thing. Some people are bringing as much of their reddit culture with them as they can and trying to make it the same.
But we will grow and change and create our own stuff.
IIRC, over half of Reddit’s traffic was US-based. I’d be interested to see if the same is true for lemmy.world.
I think it was about 47% but it was a relative majority, or a plurality as Americans call it.
or a plurality as Americans call it.
Those silly Americans, using words in line with their definitions
Huh? Everyone uses words in line with their definitions. But New Zealand English and American English have differences.
“Plurality” isn’t used in NZ English, but since there are a lot of Americans here I added it as a courtesy to make my meaning clearer.
Coming from a minority country this is just something we do.
If I were commenting about, say, what we normally call “lollies”, on a predominantly British website I would add “sweets” and on a predominantly American website I would add “candy”.
So less than half.
Yeah less than half, but still a bigger share than any other single culture, so that’s how they ended up being the dominant group on most subs.
When r/politics was created, and for a vast majority of reddits existence, Americans made up a majority of reddit, and for a long time made up a supermajority.
Of course there was a US-Bias.
It was less than half.
I’m sure they would delete non-US political news if it is part of their rules.
Rule 2 of the magazine is submissions have to be about US politics.
You get outta here with your “reading the rules” stuff.
lol
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Politics was my first blocked community on Lemmy. Then every other US politics community that has sprung up. They’re either echo chambers or flame wars and it’s irritating to use the internet as an escapism and run into arguments daily.
and run into arguments daily.
The same arguments daily! Even as a politically active American it’s utterly boring and unnecessary. Yes, we get it, you hate $PoliticalTribe and feel that you need to show everyone how awful they are. Yes, fine, they are truly terrible. Now lets talk about something else for a minute.
US people are way too blind to the existence of the outside world. I’m sure they have no idea that Lemmy.World is not in the US. I’m not really sure what could be done about this other than making a new more broad politics community. I’d prefer the generic named community to be the one that is the most broad and then if you wanted only US politics to make a more specific community such as !USPolitics@lemmy.world.
I don’t think it would be out of bounds for instance admins to force such change as they see fit if it makes enough sense.
We all have preferences, but unless you convince the admins to be onboard for moderating communities so that they all follow a specific rule and can’t be localized unless it’s part of the name, I’d say let it go. I am not comfortable with the idea of allowing majority rules to simply take over a community simply because they think they have better use for the name.
That’s how you end up with another Reddit situation
Or you know, !worldpolitics could be a thing and you could stop telling other people how to think and behave.
I’m not telling people how to think and behave. That is a weird thing to say in my opinion. I’m sharing my thoughts and feeling. I don’t mind if people disagree or have counter points to make. That is the nature of discussion.
You clearly have an agenda in asking the question. There’s no problem with that, but pretending you don’t is… weird.
I clearly stated my opinion in which I don’t even feel that strongly about. It’s just some thoughts that came to mind. I’m not trying to sneakily conspire to influence things the way I want them to be. If stating how I feel is enough to accomplish this then it must be a pretty good idea.
Unless non-American politics is being deleted then it is just who the more prolific posters are.
US politics only is in the community rules.
Look at the rules. It IS being deleted in c/politics
That is weird!
Note: didn’t notice that clicking the post heading would take me there until I checked after your reply and I’m still getting my head around the syntax for finding new communities.
I agree. on any other server it would already be questionable, but lemmy.world suggests international appeal. The default news should be world news, with each country heading their own channel.
I’ll speak to the moderators, if we should unlock it for international politics, but right now it’s US moderators and I barely know italy politics or EU politics but am Interested in adding them.
They’re trolling you, don’t open it up. This is the most popular and largest.
Then they should get more europeans, why should there only be mods from the US lol.
That’s so reductive, it’s absurd. It’s free labor to moderate these things.
Who is they? And where do these people magically spring from? If lemmy has a low content issue, surely there would be a low amount of people willing to moderate as well.
You really think Lemmy has a content issue lol?
And of course free labor don’t grow on trees but I’m pretty sure there are many that would be willing.
Because Americans were apparently the only people who wanted to work for free
I wonder if it has to do with r/politics being US only, I really don’t know mate.
It’s the same issue. Not all politics is american. It should be uspolitics instead.
Really wish fediverse didn’t also port the “first one to win the race to a keyword gets to have it” from reddit!
Although if you went world politics in a single subreddit, I can only imagine people would just fight about what really deserved to be in their imaginary “left/right” divisions.
It is going to take some getting used to, but the honest answer is to run your own instance and host your version on that. Gonna get real weird though.
I suppose it’s about moderation. It would be a bad idea to talk about European or south American politics if there’s only US moderation. Política is a very touchy matter and needs a very good and diverse moderation team.
No, it’s about Americans always thinking they come first. I was told so many times that “rEdDiT Is aN AmErIcAn wEbSiTe”… But now, they can’t pull that shit any more.
I say rename the communities.
In this case they did come first though! They registered the /c/politics community first.
But really they should change the display name to US Politics.
It doesn’t matter. The name is misleading. It’s a generic name and therefore should cover all politics. I’ve seen people claiming “ohh, but it’s only US mods”… Yes. I run a whole instance. Americans are welcome there, too and I’m from Germany. So?
I wonder how hard it would be for Lemmy devs to put in an aliasing feature, say so when a user goes to c/politics, it’ll automatically switch to c/uspolitics or something like that… That would make this easier.
Probably not hard. But that doesn’t solve the problem that a generic term is used for something US only on a platform that isn’t US first.
The point of suggesting this was to make the process of renaming the communities a little easier. Users do have to be led around by the nose, don’t they?
If you’re talking about me here, I understood why you were suggesting it. But to me, that’s not the problem of c/politics in this case. They wouldn’t want to rename, if it was possible, because “AmErIcA fIrSt”.
Which is not an issue at all. Plenty of medium-sized subs have a geographically wide spanning mod team. For a large sub like that it’s a non-issue.
Lemmy.world, an instance that aims to be international (hence the name), seems weird to me.
I never got the impression that this instance specifically aimed to be international. It always felt like the aim was to replace Reddit in whatever way that manifests itself. I never got the impression that every community needed to be equally inclusive of content from all countries.
As for !politics@lemmy.world, I think part of the problem is that changing the rule would result in very little change since
So it may be better to just keep the US users isolate where they are and create a new sub that would just be less dominated by those users.
From the Lemmy.world description:
“A generic Lemmy server for everyone to use. The World’s Internet Frontpage Lemmy.world is a general-purpose Lemmy instance of various topics, for the entire world to use.”
And the logo is an earth. It does not forbid any community restricted to one specific country (neither should it, it’s perfectly normal), but it sure isn’t specifically tied to the US. I think a fair comparison would be if c/politics was China content only, that would looks weird too (even more so because of the language but well, surely you get my point).
I just think you’re reaching to say the “world” branding has anything to do with the philosophy of the website. I think it’s cool branding and synergy with the mastodon instance. Other than that, it is no more worldly than Reddit was.
With that said, it’s no more weird that c/politics is specific to US politics than r/politics was.
Another example: !law@lemmy.world
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It also directly goes against their rule 3 which is “no discrimination”.
No, in a space that’s dominated by Americans, and where the base politics forum is US-only, this isn’t discrimination. It’s carving out a space for everyone else.
You don’t get to take over every space your eyes fucking see. You’re not Mufasa.
You don’t get to take over every space your eyes fucking see.
American politics in a nutshell.
+1 for Mufasa
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Then you’d agree that c/politics should allow any political news and discussion from around the world and not just U.S. politics, correct?
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By your logic bathrooms are discriminatory as well. Each instance can set its own rules, if you don’t like the rule then block that instance. Problem solved.
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You would probably prefer the kbin world news.
Their only rules are that “US news is world news” and don’t post nsfw.
You skipped the 2nd part.
It’s negative discrimination - when you try to limit the overwhelming power of one group over all others. That’s the reason why lots of governments have laws that mandate e.g. the minimum number of female employees etc. It is to mantain some balance.
All kinds of world news is dominated by USA relations anyway. People don’t need that and to read about every school shooting and presidential fart as well.
Another topic, but related: I mod at !playstation@lemmy.world. Since basically all the ps-related news is about the PS5, I’m asking people to post news and stuff specific to PS5 into its own community. Am I discriminating against PS5 users? Perhaps, but what’s the point of having two comms with 99% copypasted content, with anything else being drowned?
Do you believe in “reverse racism” and “heterophobia” as well?
Ok, but what you described is literally discrimination against americans. Just because they’re american, doesn’t mean its not discrimination.
Oh noes! Sumeting isn’t abowt me! Dis must be wut discwiminashun is! Help! Help! I’m bean oppressed!
QQ all day long, I guess.
If you changed the word “US” to a middle eastern country, im sure that’d receive a lot of backlash, but since you mentioned the US its acceptable. /s
Your convenient and bad-faith lack of understanding of power imbalances doesn’t make you not a giant crybaby. Go home. Y’all seem to love your isolationist imperial hellscape, just stay there and keep your nose out of what other people are doing. The rest of us don’t want you around, anyway.
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I suppose it’s also a remnant of the reddit community. I agree it sounds weird, but it was also the result of the limitations of Reddit. I don’t think you could easily create a tag for each country, and even then, it wasn’t user friendly to filter them based on your preferences. So because of this, and because r/politics was already US only to begin with, it was just the easy solution to get every other news content.
It’s not forbidding US related content, it’s preventing post about internal US affairs that we don’t care about
I can see where you’re coming from, however…Did you message the mods of /c/politics & ask if they might consider changing their display name to more clearly indicate their US focus? It’s not ideal, but the display name is what’s shown when searching for communities or seeing posts from them in local/all feeds, so it at least helps in that regard.
At the same time, as other comments point out, there are a number of other politics communities with a broader focus across other instances, so unlike Reddit, we can have a /c/politics in any number of other instances with different rules and without a US focus. In a weird way, it’s almost better that the /c/politics here is US focused, as it encourages folks to post & discuss general politics (including the US) in other smaller instances.
Although, ultimately, this would come down to whether the admins would prefer such simply named communities to have a wider focus as their name suggests instead of a narrow focus as is happening here, but I haven’t gotten the sense that the admins necessarily want to get that directly involved in community naming & creation tbh.
I think you’re missing the last part of the fully qualified name: “.world”
It’s a difference of interpretation imo. Others here understandably read it as meaning or suggesting an international focus, but others still (such as myself) read it as meaning a general focus (which is itself reinforced by the front page’s own description).
Personally I do agree with OP & others here in preferring non-specific communities like politics or law to be open to international politics & law, but I’m not in a position to make that call. Also as noted, I don’t think the admins are interested in intervening in communities so long as their moderators aren’t abusing their positions nor abandoning their accounts & letting communities go unmoderated.
So lemmy.world should not host content that is specific to the USA?
Does “world” refer to the literal world or the world of lemmy?
There goes pennsylvania@lemmy.world
Sorry guys, gotta leave.
@hyorvenn the great thing about the fediverse is that you’re not limited to lemmy.world
The politics@kbin.social doesn’t have that rule. I posted about Zimbabwe politics the other day and they seemed fine with it.
Yes it’s not a space problem, space in the fediverse is near unlimited. It’s about following the philosophy of Lemmy.world I guess.
