so like, how can american companys just go “im not american lol, your laws dont apply to me despite me operating mostly in the us”
a nice little eli5 would be cool, i get the why, but the how?
Fuck Spez
He’s such a disgusting greedy little pig boy who frankly belongs in a deep hole where nobody will find him 🙏
Saddam meme with Sadam crossed out and replaced with Spez.jpg
Interesting given that he is actually preparing for an apocalypse scenario where he hides out in a bunker only to emerge a leader of men.
https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2017/01/30/doomsday-prep-for-the-super-rich
Does he know that his net worth will be reduced to either his useful skills, or whatever the next guy gains by killing him and taking his stuff?
Seriously, you better have something real useful for your bodyguards, because they’re probably the first ones that’ll turn on you.
There was some legit talk among the wealthy a while back about how to control their
slavesservants… and the idea of bomb collars was floated…I can’t find the article at the moment (I’ll edit when I do because I’m still looking but my app tends to crash if I wait), but this is all totally on the up and up and it’s really fucking depressing that there are so many articles now about doomsday bunkers for the ultra wealthy… like they could have just pumped that money into fixing things but they don’t want to… sociopaths.
Edit- found it faster than I thought!
Rules for rulers
Which is why I am happy to be a metallurgical engineer who can blacksmith…
I love this idea of billionaires making bunkers. Pretty sure I can afford the quikrete and wheelbarrows needed to make this a better world.
Hey I’ll help fund and work that too. 💪
Maybe thats what pyramids were for.
If gdog05 can seal the doors, then they would both be tombs.
Pharaos were the OG preppers.
I agree, but what the Irish are doing is dumb. If reddit it hit with that, then so should Google and the whole of the internet, since everything can get you videos. No one should be in charge of sensoring the internet.
If you want to operate in a country, you have to abide by their laws.
If you want to restrict your people more than the rest of the world, cut yourself off from the world wide web.
I’ve read your sentence multiple times and I’ve no idea what it means.
I mean, there’s one typo where it says “it” instead of “is”, but other than that it all looks to make sense enough. By all the votes it looks like most people understand it just fine.
Google and other companies are being covered by it, as they are headquartered in Ireland for their EU activity. So what’s dumb about that? And what are you on about sensoring? Did you even read the article?
I did, and aside from youtube, I don’t see any mention in the article of “google”. Plus while what is listed out as being banned is all well and good, except one of them could have a whole lot of room for interpretation. Who’s to say what determines incitement to hatred? All listed platforms are big established entities with bankrolls and all already don’t really allow anything listed by the Irish, so really it just seems like an attempt at a money grab for Ireland to issue fines and collect cash whenever they decide.
Absolutely fuck spez.
But he’s right here. Just because he’s a fuckstick doesn’t mean he’s always wrong on every issue 100% of the time.
Various forms of censorship under the flag of ‘online safety’ have been pushed by governments since the internet began to exist. And before that with print media and television. Censorship is not the answer. Never was. First it was for porn, then it was for video games, then it was for hate speech, it’s always something.
But in the words of Captain Jean-Luc Picard,
“With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably.”
Censorship must be opposed.
I disagree since I think censorship can be desired when combatting hate speech. Maybe we just disagree how exactly we use the word ‘censorship’.
No, the community needs to cyber bully them off the platform. They need to feel rejection for their words, not censorship. Censorship lets them frame themselves as the victim as they seek out a smaller echo chamber on the fringes. They need to learn their words will turn the community against them
We still have to live with them. We can’t ignore them or silence them - we have to correct them
And what would happen when the community itself is built on hatred and welcomes hate wholeheartedly?
What do you mean? It works the same way, the opinion of the community will pull you closer to the group consensus. Too much exposure will have horrible things you don’t really believe spilling out of your mouth
Don’t go there, don’t spread word about it, don’t feed it in any way. It’s like flood water - pull others out of it if you can, but minimize your exposure
As to shutting them down if you have the ability? Shutting down a cesspool is good - it fragments the echo chamber, and some members won’t make the migration. The only question is if I trust the one making that decision to remain impartial
Yeah, trusting someone to make right decisions is hard because this trust usually ends up being betrayed sooner or later.
Regarding the first part, I meant that we as a community can’t put enough pressure on a bully to make em leave, if that bully is part of the community that supports em.
Ah, but that’s the beauty of it. Why are they here? If it’s to troll, don’t give them what they want. If it’s for social interaction… Why are they venturing out of their echo chamber?
Every interaction with a community pulls you slightly closer to the group consensus. You can fight it to some extent, but we’re wired to fit in with the tribe
Social rejection is wired similar to pain in our brains - it’s far more salient, far more memorable and impactful, than normal interactions.
The highest form of this is rejection by the community - it hurts most when everyone’s attention is on you and they all reject you. Even a single person quietly reaching out afterwards is like a lifeline - it stands out to you. It takes hundreds or thousands of “normal” interactions to counteract one extreme negative one
A supportive community back home doesn’t counteract the impacts from an away game. Don’t go to their turf, let them come to ours. Do not feed them - we have better content, they’ll lose members to us, and if we do it right they’ll shrink until their echo chambers can no longer sustain themselves
You are addressing the wrong problem. You’re focusing on the symptom rather than the disease.
Fighting hate speech rather than hatred itself only strengthens the hatred. As soon as you say “you mustn’t say that” you validate the hatred and give it power. Look at any counterculture, positive or negative. Trying to suppress it only validates it, gives it legitimacy as being important enough for the establishment to want to suppress, and if the people who might support the hatred already don’t like the people who would suppress the hate speech, you’ve just poured fuel on the fire.
The problem to be fixed isn’t hate speech, it’s hatred. It’s a tougher problem to solve, but a much more important one that you will actually get a productive effect by solving it.
You make a good point. Hate must be addressed at its root.
I see hate speech censorship as important for protecting the victims/vulnerable. How can we protect these people without this censorship?
Do you have any favourite examples of how a society can fight hatred?
how can we protect people without this censorship?
We don’t, nor should we try to.
Protecting people’s feelings from offense is not a valid activity in a free society. The second you start down the road of ‘we must regulate this guy’s words and actions to protect that guy’s feelings’ we become a nanny state full of people with paper thin skins. We accept that one consequence of free speech is that sometimes people will say things that are hurtful. We do that because the alternative is getting rid of free speech.Hate must be addressed at its root.
I could not agree more. Fighting hatred with hatred only breeds more hatred. But that seems to be the standard strategy today, it’s okay to not just refuse to tolerate intolerance, but to be actively intolerant of those who themselves seem intolerant. It is just fighting bad with bad and the result is more bad.
The way we fight the roots of hatred is with open discourse. The people who have hate in their hearts, we do not isolate them, we do not wall them off from society, we do not practice and encourage intolerance against them. We show them a better way. We make ourselves examples of doing better, not just against the people they don’t like, but against the people we don’t like.
We try to build bridges and encourage communication. For all the people who say immigrants are lazy lawbreakers, we show them immigrants who are the hardest working motherfuckers there are and pay their taxes. For the people who think black people are a problem, we introduce them to black people who break their stereotypes.
For the overwhelming majority of people who have hate in their hearts and intolerance and prejudice, those feelings are based on stereotypes.
People don’t join the KKK because they start in a mixed culture and then conclude black people are a problem. They join the KKK because they have stereotypes they see reinforced in media and TV.There was a famous Black dude whose name I don’t remember, but he of his own volition managed to deprogram a whole bunch of KKK members. All he did was sit down and fucking talk to them. That’s it. Like sit down at the bar next to them and start a conversation. Many of the KKK members had never encountered a respectable well-spoken black person before (let alone one willing to talk to them) and were completely blown away because it broke the stereotype of a black person that they joined the KKK to fight against.
A good number of them ended up leaving the KKK and giving this man their robes on the way out. So there’s this friendly black dude who has a big box of KKK robes that were given to him by ex-members he deprogrammed.That is how we fight hate. We fight hate with love, we fight intolerance with tolerance and open arms, we fight stereotypes with exposition, we fight ignorance with knowledge.
Otherwise it’s like we are saying there’s too much stupidity in society so we’re going to prevent people with lower IQs from attempting school. It doesn’t work.
There was a famous Black dude whose name I don’t remember, but he of his own volition managed to deprogram a whole bunch of KKK members.
His name is Daryl Davis. For anyone not familiar, he has some great videos about this on Youtube/proxies.
That’s absolutely the one! Truly great American. We could all learn a thing or two from him.
Who would you have define hate speech in the US? SCOTUS?
Many citizens may agree on the definition, but I wouldn’t trust our government to draw those lines.
Many countries have working anti-hate speech laws. It’s not really a big problem for freedom of speech in those countries.
Those countries don’t have partisan polarization propaganda preschoolers writing their legislation.
While often better than in the US, you shouldn’t overestimate the state of democracy in other countries.
A lot of the far right parties in Europe are successfully copying the polarization tactics from the US.
Yep it’s great
Hate speech ✖️
Alliteration ✔️
Simple :)
Romania has a law against hate speech
*Freedom of Expression
We don’t have Freedom of Speech, but we do have Freedom of Expression. Important difference, even though it may freak out some Americans.
Except for the countries that have anti-hate laws that are deliberately vague and specifically used to jail anyone who is disliked by the government. China and Russia come to mind as examples, but I’m sure they aren’t the only ones.
Besides hate-speech, I’m not sure how much should be censored really. China does a lot of censoring to ‘protect’ their citizens from everything, I’m not sure this would be a good thing even if that really was a goal.
And protecting children from traumatising content looks like another good thing to do, but under that banner I usually see governments doing whatever they want without caring about children past using their image.
It requires them to restrict certain categories of video, so that users cannot share content on cyberbullying, promoting eating disorders, promotion of self harm or incitement to hatred on a number of grounds.
Yeh, fuck censorship. Let’s all be shitbags and do that stuff instead!
To be fair, censorship on Reddit is already very very aggressive. I was banned for saying “yay” on a news thread about the death of the queen.
You don’t have to be a porn star or even a porn consumer to oppose laws banning porn.
And you don’t have to be a shitbag to recognize that, while well-intentioned, censorship is still censorship.
I have absolutely no love whatsoever for the people who would spread such crap. I would love to get rid of it. But banning the speech doesn’t do that. It’s like smashing the altimeter in the airplane and then declaring that you’re not crashing anymore. But the reality is, smashing instruments in the airplane is never a great idea whether you are crashing or not. It just prevents you from seeing things you don’t want to. And you get hurt in the process.
Censorship, historically, has never ended up anywhere good.
Porn is performed by consenting adults and consumed by consenting adults.
That’s why porn made from human trafficking, revenge porn (ie leaking nudes of an ex) etc are illegal in most sane countries.
The idea being that porn doesn’t hurt anyone.Hate speech is harmful. It’s purpose is to hurt people.
So yeh, it should be illegal.
I have no issues discussing hate speech. I do have issues with hate speech being used.There’s a big difference between hate speech and revenge porn.
A person has rights to their likeness and image. That’s why anybody who goes in front of a camera, be it a porn star or a model or an actor, signs a ‘model release’ giving the photographer authorization to publicize and sell their images. Without that simple one page contract, nothing in the photo shoot can be published. Porn actors do that. And in fact, they usually do it on video, where the actor holds up their driver’s license and says ‘my name is blah blah I am a pornographic actor and I am consenting to have sex on camera today and authorize this production company to publicize and sell the resulting video’ or something like that. Revenge porn victims have made no such agreement, and while the penalties are stronger because of the harm it causes them, the legal basis for having any penalty at all is simply that they did not consent to having their likeness and image publicized.
Hate speech has no such issue. It may be harmful to a person or group, but if you remove the very broad ‘hatred’ label, it becomes just an opinion that would otherwise be protected speech.
The other problem is that what considers hatred is very much subjective. For example, if I say wanting to own a gun is evidence of mental illness, a lot of people on Lemmy will agree with that and I will probably get upvotes. If I say wanting to use the bathroom of other than your biological genetic sex is evidence of mental illness, I will probably get banned. What is the difference between the two? Supporting LGBT rights is popular, supporting the second amendment is not. So you create the situation where the only difference between a valid opinion and an invalid one is whether or not it’s accepted mainstream, and that’s a bad way to go.
Also, in a free country, it is generally considered that expressing an opinion which may be detrimental to others is not in itself considered bad. If I say that people over 80 years old should require a yearly driving test, that’s a valid position for me to have and nobody will call me ageist for saying it. If I say that Donald Trump should be arrested rather than elected, that is directly detrimental to a person but it would get me upvotes here. If I said that being Republican is evidence of mental illness, that is directly prejudicial against an entire group which has many different reasons for believing as they do, and it would probably get me upvotes also.
My point is, hate speech as a concept is difficult to define and when you try to ban it with censorship you are just starting down a slippery slope that will have the opposite of the desired effect. You legitimize the counterculture and do nothing to stop the real problem, the actual hatred.
It’s not difficult to define.
It’s about people’s choices.People can choose to own a gun, choose to want to own a gun, choose to own a whole armoury.
I think owning a gun is stupid. I live in a country that successfully regulates guns.
Saying “I think gun owners are stupid” isn’t hate speech because they have chosen to own a gun.
If I said “gun owners should use their guns in themselves” that becomes hate speech because it’s wishing harm on them.People choose to be Republicans, trumps choices in life are why he is where he is.
Hate trump because of what he does, not because he has blonde hair.People don’t choose to be gay, or be trans, or be Jewish, or be black, or be short or whatever.
Which is another way opinions can become hate speech.
If I said “I think gun owners are stupid” that isn’t hate speech.
If I said “I think black people are stupid” that becomes hate speech because it is grouping people by something they have no control over.How about incitements to violence and outright explicit disinformation/misinformation, like:
- [group] should be [violent act]
- [group] are [dehumanizing pejorative] that deserve [violent act]
- [dogwhistle for the actual Nazis, like the 14 words, terminology specifically referencing the Final Solution, etc]
- [hard r] are [extreme dehumanizing pejorative] and don’t deserve [human rights]
- [violent or repulsive act] the [slur]
- “Despite only making up 13%…”
- “Whites create and forget, [slur]s copy and remember…”
For the record, I personally think everything you said is truly repugnant. Although I’d point out the first one I’ve seen applied to Trump voters, frequently, in mainstream discussions on ‘civilized’ platforms, with little or no moderator response. So apparently it’s okay to be prejudiced and discriminatory as long as it’s against someone others don’t like.
That said, my problem is not the banning of these statements. Most platforms quite reasonably would ban such things, and I have no problem with that.
What I have a problem with is the government REQUIRING a platform ban certain speech. I don’t care if it’s the most vile horrible hate filled shit. It should be up to the platform, not the government, to decide what speech is acceptable or not.
Because if government gets to decide what private citizens are allowed to discuss on privately-owned forums, that’s a very slippery slope.
And I still say it’s counterproductive.
I think reducing the visibility of some kinds of content can be good, especially for those under 18. E.g. when it comes to content around suicide, I think it is better if children/teenagers see “there is support for you, please speak to a charity for free on this phone number” instead of pro-suicide content.
That I would actually very much agree with. As Elon himself said in the early days of the Twitter takeover, “free speech does not mean free reach”.
This is also why I think engagement algorithms are a cancer on our civilization. If it is in a platforms monetary interest to amplify the most vile anger inducing stuff, be that stuff that is actively bad like hate speech or simply divisive like a lot of political crap, that is bad for our society. It pushes us farther apart when we should be coming together to fix the problems that we can agree on.
As Elon himself said in the early days of the Twitter takeover, “free speech does not mean free reach”.
I understood that to mean “I want to claim I’m a ‘free speech absolutist’ while actually only promoting things I agree with”
In concept I agree with him on that. I support your right to say awful shit, but I am not going to spread that message to others. Where Elon lost the plot was thinking of Twitter as a public square. It’s a nice thought, but it requires the whole platform to be 100% neutral and unbiased. So it’s all good to call Twitter the public square, but that’s a lot harder to take seriously when the guy in charge of policing the square is heavily biased.
it’s all good to call Twitter the public square, but that’s a lot harder to take seriously when the guy in charge of policing the square is heavily biased
I agree. A public town square is good but like you say, it should be neutral, and Xitter is not that.
On the censorship thing, maybe it is okay if an online messaging website bans certain content, like pro-suicide content, or pro-terrorism content, etc. You could call that censorship but you could also call it safety. I don’t think anybody really believes in 100% free speech anyway, because if a person shouts “FIRE!” in a crowded theatre, when there is actually no fire, and it causes a stampede which kills people, should we not punish their speech because they’re free to say it?
Freedom of political speech is important, but maybe there should be some fundamental rules about certain types of speech.
On the censorship thing, maybe it is okay if an online messaging website bans certain content, like pro-suicide content, or pro-terrorism content, etc. You could call that censorship but you could also call it safety.
I think that should go either way and I have no problem if a platform decides to ban that kind of stuff. I certainly have no desire to consume such material.
I have a BIG problem when the government decides that platforms are required to ban things. Even if they’re things I don’t myself want to read.
It’s a slippery slope.
It requires them to restrict certain categories of video, so that users cannot share content on cyberbullying, promoting eating disorders, promotion of self harm or incitement to hatred on a number of grounds.
Wow, what a horrible, restraining overreach.
I am shedding tears for the 1.2% engagement loss this would cost Reddit next quarter. Imagine what they have to pay devs for filtering abusive videos!
(I hate to sound so salty, but its mind boggling that they would fight this so vehemently, instead of just… filtering abusive content? Which they already do for anything that actually costs them any profit).
Well…the problem is reddit’s size.
I’m not part of reddit anymore because they filtered me out for abusive content.
The content that was so abusive? I told a story on /r/Cleveland about the time 35 years ago I got my bike stolen.
I wasn’t accusing any current reddit user of being the theif. But reddit bots flagged me of being abusive to other users.
We don’t even know if that guy who stole my bike 35 years ago is even still alive, much less an active redditor on /r/Cleveland. So who am I being abusive to, when I say it’s a bad idea to let strangers ride your bike without some kind of assurance you’ll get it back?
I got banned when I told a literal Nazi, that said that literal Jews should die, should drink bleach to purify their genes before they contaminated the genepool.
I still stand by it. my grandfather fucked up Nazis, and I’ll fuck up Nazis too.
based
This is a common tactic. I’ve seen people describe the same process many times before.
- Nazi says literal Nazi shit.
- Person gets baited into responding.
- Person gets ban hammer. Nazi does not.
- Nazi moves on to next target. Repeat from step 1.
They usually trot this out when they see a comment or account they want to silence. That’s how the fascists do censorship on reddit.
It’s happened to me too. Since then I’ve seen people saying the same general thing has happened to them. They must know that reddits content moderators, the “Anti-evil Operations” or whatever bullshit, is on their side. It’s the only explanation. Probably the nazis went and got jobs there. Or maybe it’s just that spez is a nazi himself. Reddit beneath the thin veneer of default subreddits has always been a very right leaning platform.
Anarchy in the US baby!
Fair. +1
But also, that just sounds like they’re cheaping out on content filtering. And, you know, kinda broke the enthusiastic community moderation that made it great in the first place.
Yes, that’s true. This all happened like 3 weeks after they went public IPO. I didn’t buy it, because I thought reddit had a decent chance of falling on it’s ass on the free market. It’s a 10+ year old company that’s never made a profit. It’s reasonable to assume it might fail.
3 weeks after I declined, and they went public, I suddenly get 3 temporary bans in a week, and the 3rd one was a permanent ban. All by autobots.
Yeah same here, the last post I made was to argue for more disabled access to European historical sites n the r/europe subreddit.
After everything I’ve posted, THAT is what got me banned.
After loosing my appeal, I changed all my prior posts to AI generated gibberish.
Fuck Reddit, salt your posts so they can’t use your content to make money on search or train AI.
I wish I could, but I have hundreds of thousands if not millions of comments.
Look at my time here, and now look at how many comments I have here, and know that I am running at MAYBE 5% of my posting capacity.
Lemmy just is barren of content if you don’t care about politics, linux, or star trek.
There are some extensions that can edit your comments automatically.
Decepticons probably wouldn’t be any more permissive, though.
Well…the problem is reddit’s size.
They’ve never been shy about targeting certain subs and communities for shutdown when it suits their commercial interests. This has nothing to do with size and everything to do with the nature of the content itself.
These videos are pure clickbait. They feed engagement. They build up lots of enthusiasm both among content providers and active users. And, as a consequence, they make the company money.
But reddit bots flagged me of being abusive to other users.
Bots will flag any post purely based on keyword searches and AI parsing of sentiment. Its got nothing to do with your actual statement. But it also depends heavily on who you are, where you post, and how often other users flag you. Very possibly you simply got “Report” flagged a bunch of times by other users for some reason and that - plus a naive parsing - was all the AI bot needed to know.
But I’ll also bet the post wasn’t getting thousands of unique interactions and external visits. If you’d been a power-poster who was posting a face-cam rant rather than a text blob, I suspect you’d have been fine.
same with me and /r/Toronto got banned for stating a long dead prime minister was horrible to indigenous people. they used the excuse that I was submitting too many articles about crimes in the city as that subreddit’s mods automatically remove any content about crime or pro Palestinian content.
Post god knows how many photos of the CN tower, the fucking sun setting or snow…hey that’s great! anything that’s news worthy and potentially paints the city in a bad light? nope, censored. It’s so bad that i’m convinced the mods there are being paid under the table by the City.
The problem is Reddit’s CEO. Fullstop
I hate Reddit as much as the next guy but that just sounds like an asshole mod
In 3 different unrelated subs, and all said to be performed as an automated action?
Also of note, I got permabanned on May 7th.
May 4th I joined Mastadon. Using the same email as my reddit email.
I’m gonna have to ask you to stop abusing whatever random reddit mod flagged you back then in case they might be here. Or else.
They would have to hire a shitload of people to police it all along with the rest of the questionable shit on there, like jailbait or whatever other shit they turned a blind eye to until it showed up on the news
Not saying it’s right but from a business standpoint it makes sense
Don’t they flag stuff automatically?
Not sure what they’re using on the backend, but open source LLMs that take image inputs are good now. Like, they can read garbled text from a meme and interpret it with context, easily. And this is apparently a field thats been refined over years due to the legal need for CSAM detection anyway.
They do, but they’d still need someone to go through the flagging and check. Reddit gets away with it as it is like Facebook groups do, by offloading the moderation to users, with the admins only being roped in for ostensibly big things like ban evasion/site wide bans, or lately, if the moderators don’t toe the company line exactly.
I doubt that they would use an LLM for that. That’s very expensive and slow, especially for the volume of images that they would need to process. Existing CSAM detectors aren’t as expensive, and are faster. They basically compute a hash for the image, and compare it to known hashes for CSAM.
Small LLMs are quite fast these days, even the multimodal ones. Same with small models explicitly used to filter diffusion output.
A shitload of people, like as many as 10!
I hate to sound so salty, but its mind boggling that they would fight this so vehemently, instead of just… filtering abusive content?
I guess it’s just enshittification. Profits are their first priority.
Probably would require them to actually pay moderators! The horror!
I wonder what the investors like Condé Nast/Advance Publications think of this?
I’m a little surprised to hear people so willing to let the government of Ireland determine who they are allowed to hate and for what reasons.
Because at this point, I trust the Irish government more than Reddit to make proper moderation judgements.
It’s not a high bar, and not ideal… but I feel social media’s raging internal issues have overshadowed the fear of governments worming their way inside, at least in my eyes.
You are making such a useless point that requires minimal effort or thought. It would be better if you actually shared a tangible concern rather than providing a strawman argument meant to cause an irrational fear in people reading your comment.
For example, you could have shared which group of people you want to be a protected class and is not by Irish law; or which group of people is currently a protected class by Irish law and should not be. At least, then, you would have brought up a real concern about how the Irish government is determining hate speech; because right now, all you are doing is fear mongering.
I oppose letting anyone define hate speech as a matter of principle, because even if I agree with the definition completely now, I may not continue to agree with the definition in the future. Look at what has been happening in the USA since the October 7 attack: a lot of people I had considered my political allies turned out to have beliefs I consider to be hateful, and meanwhile these people consider my own beliefs hateful. The solution is not to empower a single central authority to decide which sort of hate is allowed. It is (as it has always been) to maintain the principle of free speech.
How about incitements to violence and outright explicit disinformation/misinformation, like:
- [group] should be [violent act]
- [group] are [dehumanizing pejorative] that deserve [violent act]
- [dogwhistle for the actual Nazis, like the 14 words, terminology specifically referencing the Final Solution, etc]
- [hard r] are [extreme dehumanizing pejorative] and don’t deserve [human rights]
- [violent or repulsive act] the [slur]
- “Despite only making up 13%…”
- “Whites create and forget, [slur]s copy and remember…”
The moved their jurisdiction to the Netherlands? In the EU? Wow. Now the GDPR can be used to really kick their butts.
It moved from Ireland to the Netherlands, both are in the EU. This will not change anything regarding GDPR.
GDPR applies regardless of where headquarters are located
Yes, but it’s easier to enforce EU regulations when the headquarters happens to be within the EU.
A move from Ireland to the Netherlands doesn’t really change much in that regard.
Idk, they’re a bit closer to Brussels, so there’s that…
There is always the issue of “x applies” and “x is enforcable”. Think of Signal or Telegram here.
Aren’t there tax benefits to incorporating in Ireland? Conventional thought would suggest that the tax/regulatory environment in the Netherlands would be less attractive? Maybe that’s wrong… I wonder what their reasons for moving were. Is that where Steve Huffman wants to build his new doomsday bunker? Gotta spread out just in case. Maybe connect it to the one in CA with a massive underwater tunnel lol clown
They usually operate in tandem, a double dutch irish tax sandwich or whatever it is called.
Oh we got a bunch of leeches in Europe, Ireland is not the only one
Mmm… Serpent Road…
They would be forced to delete all messages of all deleted users
Dear Netherlands,
The pigboy is your problem now. Sorry not sorry.
Sincerely,
Everyone else
You can almost hear the EU lawyers cracking their knuckles and quietly saying: “about that user data protection.”
Yeah, moving to the EU to escape regulation doesn’t seem like a smart move.
Nobody except himself has ever accused Steve Huffman of being smart.
Um… Did you read the article? It’s about moving their EU Headquarters from Ireland to the Netherlands. GDPR applied before and after. This is specifically about Irish censorship requirements.
Why does anyone still use reddit? Why does anyone still use Twitter? Why does anyone still use Instagram?
Why does anyone still use chrome!
I get twitter and reddit because of the uniqueness of the platforms but chrome is just a web browser! Any other program can be used in its stead to view the same exact websites yet people continue to use it even being stubborn about it!
Reddit has an absolutely massive wealth of community knowledge. If you want to find a community for $thing or gain obscure knowledge on $thing, that’s where you go (assuming there isn’t an old forum post from before Reddit killed forums).
Twitter is where a lot of people still are. If you’re the kind of person to care what a particular person says, that’s where you probably want to be.
Instagram is used by young people who have friends on Instagram.
It isn’t a great system, but it is the system that we have today. This is why legislation compelling Meta/Twitter/whothefuckever to act in an ethical manner is important. Social media is to some extent a natural oligopoly, and unless we get extremely, extremely lucky, the fediverse will always be a niche community.
Find me easier to access niche communities and I’ll be gone from reddit. I hoped Lemmy would blow up. Instead, reddit just shrank.
Find me easier to access niche communities
Have fun trying to discuss anything that isn’t about linux, american politics or reddit/amazon/elon bad!!. Lemmy is just a decentralized circle jerk.
Well i guess we should have seen it coming right. The people pissed enough with Reddit to leave were most likely to be technology proficient users and bourgeois hating leftists
Some of us prefer not drowning in bots and pathologically hostile individuals.
And some subreddits have fascist mods who arbitrarily ban anyone who’s not a alt-right or worse.
And that too
Forgot people whose only opinion is hating the website they’re on.
I do not hate the concept of lemmy and the fediverse, But I’m also not going to pretend that lemmy at its current state isn’t a circle jerk. Lemmy needs more diverse groups of people. Like GrammerPolice said above, most people who migrated from reddit were people with very strong stance on their opinions. And there’s intense hostility to anything that is even slightly against what they believe in.
Lemmy has in many ways been a successful copy of reddit; lemmy has many of the same faults as reddit.
I do feel like part of questioning process is what can possibly be adjusted to reduce some of the problems? Otherwise it just feels like generic poopooing like one might see on reddit.
This is true, but at the same time, your posts on let me don’t get buried as easily. And the karma hear truly doesn’t matter.
It’s mildly frustrating that you can’t post anything that’s even remotely close to positive about any use of AI, or any positive information whatsoever about Tesla over SpaceX without being said that you’re sucking musks cock. But in those respects the only thing different between Lemmy and Reddit is the number of people that will come to your defense, and of course in Reddit if no one comes to your defense your post is basically buried.
You’re all so far less likely to have a reasonable post here removed. Yes it still happens, yes a few of the communities are still moderated by biased enough individuals to delete your content but it’s much less prevalent than it was at reddit.
That said, yeah if you are mostly conservative you are going to have a very bad time trying to soapbox here
‘karma’ has the same use here just as in reddit imo. it buries your post/comment but it is not as amplified as on reddit only because of the rate of new content made in lemmy. And when the mods get tired of modding in the future they would just bot it based on … votes.
iirc someone already made a moderation bot for that.
Yeah I really wish people in niche communities would just migrate over. I honestly don’t understand why they haven’t yet.
Because Reddit unites everyone with the same interest in a single or at worst few subreddits. Lemmy has over 9000 instances with a bunch of communities each, half of which are defederating the other half without their users even knowing. If we thought reddit search was bad, lemmy search is non-existent. I really wanted lemmy to work, but even for someone with decent knowledge about tech it was a nightmare to figure this out. The main advantage of fediverse which is the decentralization turned out to be its main disadvantage with so much fragmentation and censorship in the form of defederation…
This stealth defederating is the worst.
stealt
Yes, people were hating on shadow banning, but this is ever worse as it will happen to you even if you did nothing wrong. All you had to do is choose the wrong instance, which everyone said it didn’t matter what you picked at the beginning.
I hoped Lemmy would blow up.
Blow up one server and three new will sprout.
This is basically asking why anyone would live in or near a city like Los Angeles or New York City when Minot exists and has everything you could possibly need.
If you had to look up where Minot even is, you’ve proven my point.
Say what you will about whether living near the proverbial big city is worth it or not. But it cannot be denied, there is a world of experiences on offer at larger platforms that a smaller platform simply cannot provide. Network effect can be a cruel mistress.
Why not Minot?
Season’s the reason!
A lot of stuff ONLY has viable Q&A discussion there…
As much as I love the idea of Lemmy, try finding active communities here for: MAME or any other videogame emulation… Plex… The breed of your family dog/cat… Most any sort of non-Fedi-focused brand/podcast/personality…
Yes, I can create a new community. Then I just sit in it by myself, and occasionally deal with spam.
Discoverability is poor on Lemmy and isn’t helped by the low user count.
Would be nice to revisit an old idea from Newsgroups, where you could sub to gaming and see everything, or gaming.playstation.ps5 or gaming.emulation.mame or whatever for sub-communities.
But then the decentralised nature works against it there as well.
Because people do not care. It is that simple.
As someone who only recently joined Lemmy (as a result of getting booted from Reddit) it ultimately comes down to it being bigger.
You can talk regularly about series have been over for a decade. Just about any niche interest has a vibrant community. The reality is the average person doesn’t care about it selling our data, putting a fingerprint on our gear one step above spyware, it being overrun with bots, every level of administration being dominated by megalomaniacs. If you just want to look through some stuff you’re interested in while you’re bored, it serves a purpose that lemmy unfortunately can’t at it’s size.
These comments are so braindead, Jesus Christ.
Yeah, Reddit is not the ghost town I thought it would be after the mass exodus.
I don’t get why more people didn’t move to Lemmy or mbin
Inertia is a bitch. That’s why.
Because most people did not use 3rd party apps and do not care about site′s management. Why move to someplace else if everything works great where you already are.
In my case it didn’t work great. Without 3rd party apps reddit died. I see your point tho. Some people are fine with a buggy ass client full of ads
Like we had a secret (or not so secret) desire for it to crumble so we can crack a beer and say good riddance. 😁
But in the end, business mostly as usual.
It’s still active – save the communities that got kneecapped by mods during the revolt (and sadly, most of those are now Discord-based rather than having any appreciable activity here).
The activity there now is a lot… dumber. Like much of the internet, the ratio of real people to braindead bots on Reddit is a lot different than a few years ago.
You don’t know why someone would use a social link aggregator… and you’re lamenting about this on a social link aggregator.
Why are you here?
Almost like they asked about a specific site and not the concept of link aggregators or something
Almost
It was still a brain-dead question, even for a rhetorical one.
Exactly. Really incomprehensible why are some people amazed at some things. We’re all different, with different motives, different needs, different levels of coziness and different views on privacy etc.
For Twitter it really doesn’t make sense because it has become undebatably a “Nazi bar”, metaphorically since they aren’t an actual bar, but they still support and tolerate Nazis (and other manners of horrible people). Some people insist that it isn’t and there are “normal level headed people there” but that doesn’t matter, it’s still a Nazi bar, because it accepts and tolerates Nazis. How can someone expect to not be judged for going to and hanging out in a place like that?
Most people don’t care. I’m sick of hearing about Reddit, I left because I do care but I don’t want to keep hearing about my ex, you know!
We are not important, we are the minority that maybe cares about these things and that’s ok, we should live our lives the way we want to and allow others to do the same.
Agreed. Yes, it’s important to know what’s going on in the “big” world - but I wish all of us more interested in Lemmy, the small web, and so on spent more time and energy on creating, maintaining, and enjoying what we can build/use and less lamenting, bashing, or wishing for what we want to leave behind.
Exactly! It reeks of superiority; I prefer to just live my life and if people are curious about the decisions I make then I’ll try and enlighten people, but if they don’t care still then that’s ok. We can’t force people to be like us and wouldn’t want too either, because I wouldn’t want people to try and force me to go back to Reddit for instance.
𝕴𝖙 𝖎𝖘 𝖙𝖎𝖒𝖊 𝖋𝖔𝖗 𝖞𝖔𝖚 𝖙𝖔 𝖗𝖊𝖙𝖚𝖗𝖓 𝖙𝖔 𝖗𝖊𝖉𝖉𝖎𝖙!
because their friends are there
or in reddit’s case, because they think their friends are there
Because people dream of making it big, being viral, being an influencer with a ton of followers and money. That one second of fame is still tantalising to a lot of people.
Also a lot of these apps (not reddit, but the others like Facebook) are installed on phones by default. To many, they are just what the internet is.
Nana and grandad used to do email. Now it’s just racist rainbowflag-phobic reposting on Facebook and wondering why their grandkids that haven’t looked at FB in a decade don’t contact them.
I use it for porn still
first Tumblr banned porn, then Reddit requires sign-in for 18+ content (I know old UI bypasses that), and now Twitter has become a walled garden as well. Bad times for gooners
Why does anyone still use Reddit?
Some niche communities and content to repost on Lemmy
Why does anyone still use Instagram?
Friends and memes to repost on Lemmy
Because social networks are only as good as the people who are on them.
Complacency
Overall, because Lemmy is slow and boring mostly. I see headlines here and go to Reddit for the comments through the geddit crawler.
I gotta disagree with you here. At least on the sub(s) that I still - on the occasion of big events - take a glance at. To me, Reddit comments are the epitome of staleness and predictability. Also, their user base seems like a bunch of 40-year-old dads that mentally peaked at 16, but keep getting more racist by the year.
Tbh I cant ban subs so when I crawl R/all I get mostly bots, reposts and thirst traps which sucks but there is no long term discussion threads here. Nothing like a review thread on the movies sub or music subs, where there are hundreds or thousands of views to skim.
reddit has half functioning search.
i seen a few people still use it my friend,some random people in a server,etc
Maybe because they just want to???
What’s wrong with Instagram now?
Centralized and owned by meta. Harvesting your data constantly. Ads upon ads that track you. Proprietary.
Idea: Governments maintain a list of entities that are evading the law like that, and then doesn’t prosecute people who are accused of crimes against such entities. The idea being that if you place yourself outside of the law’s reach, you also place yourself outside of the law’s protection.
That’s a bingo!
We just say bingo…
That’s a bingo…
I‘m confused. Reddit claims it doesn’t host videos, just links to them but it absolutely does host videos.
All their media is hosted under the redditstatic domain, and as far as I can tell, that’s hosted on AWS. (There’s actually also a redditmedia domain, which they may also use, but that’s also on AWS).
That probably means that Reddit can get away with saying they don’t host any of it. They merely point their web addresses at the third party host.
No, they really can’t. They own and operate the redditstatic domain and rent the server space from AWS. De jure that makes them the hoster.
But they provide the methods of uploading, deleting and viewing the contents of that storage to their end users.
So, it’s Reddits storage.They are responsible for that AWS account. No court in its right mind would think otherwise.
Not since the last half decade.edit: i read the comment backwards. oops.
You can upload videos straight to Reddit in 2024
Read the comment backwards :/
Decade half last the since not?
Darn you Redditors and your code speak!!Slightly Disappointed But Also Relieved You Don’t Type Like This Anymore Jaden
How Can Capital Letters Be Real If Our Eyes Aren’t Real???
as a connoisseur of science on Reddit, I can most assuredly confirm Reddit does host video content.
Check edit
From article
Reddit challenged its designation on the basis that it is mostly a text-based discussion platform, and links to videos uploaded elsewhere on the internet should not be factored in. The Irish regulator counter-argued that the audio-visual content on the platform is extensive, and pointed to its enormous reach, with 73 million daily users.
Could not find any post statistics, but they probably are correct and percentage wise uploaded videos should be at the bottom, but total count probably is too large to be simply disregarded. Reddit probably has more videos than Vimeo which is purely video based. And if Reddit would be in the clear then so should be Twitter and Facebook since those too are primarily text based.
Welkom in Nederland, moederneuker!
Vierenveertig vliegjen en een goudvis in de pinderkaas op de lul in een konijntjenaaimachine!
Terlinglijer
Ma naiers!
What a weaselly thing to do
Shut up, Weasley!
Eat slugs, Malfoy!
I was going for a TNG reference. The HP reference was entirely unintentional, though may have been unconscious.
Should’ve been Wesley for TNG. Funny nonetheless. 😂
I was combining Wesley with weaseley
the utility of the nation/state has been broken by 21st century meta-national billionaires
unions are useful but they no longer cover the distance between labor and capital
we need a new group of collective shit to aspire to because humans gonna human
The Un doesn’t do it for you/us?
Lol
Lmao even
Sounds like another case of US tech companies fucking with the web of EU regulations to nobody’s benefit but their own.
It’s no wonder they moved to another tax haven. Sorry, sorry. The EU doesn’t have tax havens according to their own rules. Low tax threshold geographic jurisdictions.
Wait isn’t Ireland an EU tax haven?
The EU has a blacklist of tax havens around the world. And, according to the rules the EU decided, no EU member is a tax haven. 🙃
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_Union_tax_haven_blacklist
Apparently, according to that link, they did try to class Ireland and the Netherlands as “countries with traits of tax havens” but the recommendation hasn’t been implemented. Quelle suprise.
Of course it has. It says everything you need to know
Maybe they should be investigated for all the child porn they used to host and the TD contributions to the riots
To this day, I still can’t believe how long Reddit defended underage porn subreddits. Literally do nothing and say “free speech” . Then suddenly a news article happens and then they finally take action.
It’s almost like spez cares more about money than any kind of moral grandstanding, which of course is super weird for a capitalist
https://www.nytimes.com/2023/01/18/technology/dutch-school-privacy-google-microsoft-zoom.html
If anything, the Dutch will enforce more laws on them
Time for the EU to rip him a new one :)
